On this episode of Spark: Games, play, and technology with Jesse Schell and Kevin Kelly. Click below to listen or download the MP3 (runs 54:00).
Play audio:
- Jesse Schell on the psychology of video games, and the “gamification” of life (full interview)
- Jesse is the CEO of Schell Games
- Jesse teaches at the Entertainment Technology Center at Carnegie Mellon University
- Video: Jesse’s DICE 2010 Presentation on Games & Psychology
- Jesse’s book: The Art of Game Design: A book of lenses
- Kevin Kelly on the importance of play and the pleasures of wasting time (full interview)
- Kevin Kelly’s book What Technology Wants comes out in October 2010
Music and sound effects used in this episode:
- Clips from This Is Your Life Melton Berle
- “Wadidyusay?” by Zap Mama
- “eighteen pieces (soda)” by soda
- “Alchemist” by Celestial Aeon Project
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[Original image by broma]
Nora
I listen to CBC allot and caught this episode about games.
I myself am a freelance cartoonist and I make cartoon puzzles which I publish in newspapers. I started making them as I really enjoyed doing them whenever I came across one. I still make and publish them but recently with the decline of print media and newspapers becoming less the mainstream I find myself looking into new directions for extra work. This lead me to do some work in the gaming industry and I illustrated a card game and talks are in the works for other projects too.
I myself am actually developing my first card game which will be designed and illustrated by myself. As my friends would say it will be more of a beer and pretzels game which is why I am writing this to in the first place.
I myself like to play games that are fun and are not more paperwork than fun. This comes from a background of playing RPG's… role playing games like Dungeons and Dragons. My friends like to play these game and to this day play fairly regular but the types they play are so much paperwork for so little playtime and not really that appealing to me anymore. Life is too busy for me to take on a third job of paperwork just to play a game.
I say that since I still have a day job and I am a freelance cartoonist as well.
But with that said I myself would rather play a game that is more fun than work and so hopefully in a few years I will have done illustrations for some games and have a few of my own design out there as well.
PS; I am going to look into Jesse's book for sure.
Pierre C. Arseneault
Freelance cartoonist
http://www.pcatoons.com
Listening to Jesse and Nora talk about the "game-ification" of life, I am worried about the ever increased focus on external sources of motivation. Instant feedback, the "attention" economy, and pokemon points for walking all provide new hooks for marketers to motivate us to attach to external objects for gratification – we have not easily become immune to the incredibly destructive effects of graphic and television marketing. What are the ultimate effects of these trends? I am not optimistic that the "social marketing" element will win out over the profiteers in efforts to motivate people to do things differently.
Interesting comment, and I do share some of your reservations, as I alluded to in my Skinner Box question. I'll be curious to know what you think of Daniel Pink on this week's show. He talks about intrinsic motivation as opposed to extrinsic. I think, though, that what unites both of them is the idea that humans are natural puzzle solvers, and we derive a lot of pleasure out of it, whether that's formally in a game, or informally in solving problems. I wonder if we necessarily need rewards (money or points), as long as we structure tasks in a more game-like/puzzle-like fashion.
Hi Nora,
I am a serious gen-Xer, way too serious…..and it occurred to me that "game-ification" of any learning (or duel), could lighten up me up. I really appreciated Jesse's insight that good games are brought up with a multitude of perspectives.
Imagine lawyers on games.
Great show and thanks.
More than 350 million people in the world that play Farmville and you managed to find a so-called 'expert' that not only does not play, but could not be bothered to spend a bit of time actually making sure he knew what he was talking about before going on the air to talk about it!
There are only about 100m Farmville users — and much fewer of them active. I thought the interview was interesting and that being a gaming expert involves understanding the principles behind games rather than playing all of them.
Great interview on gaming and life. As an teacher, there have been many who suggest that education should be more like an interactive video game. A view I've always been cautious about. This interview certainly but things in a different perspective for me. If we consider how games can be high touch and interactive learning that is engaging at just the right difficulty then we are talking about what we as teachers try to do each day. I plan on using part of your podcast for an upcoming presentation for parents. Thanks,
Thanks! We're always very happy when something on Spark triggers discussion in educational circles. So many teachers are heavily engaged in innovation in pedagogy!
listened to show today- on "failings" typed it in google- could not find it? can you give us the url?
@emurphy — you’ll find a link in the show notes for Spark 109. The URL is http://failin.gs
Jesse mentioned it would be neat to see a digital math game that rewarded kids for correct answers. I have a game like that on my iPhone called Kids Math that applauds when the kid gets a right answer and my 6-yr-old loves it. The only problem is that he also loves the sound the game makes when he gets a wrong answer – especially repeatedly which gets a bit of a song going.
owning a couple of blogs and websites and monetizing them with adsense or adbrite is a good way to Work at home. you can also answer paid surveys but most of them are scam sites.