I appreciate the excellent points you raised. Perhaps what is most disturbing is that the transformation of the issue from an appalling act of violence into fuel for racism against an increasingly marginalized group. We should stay focused on the issue of violence.

I hope as time moves forward you have many slow days at work as it is a reflection on us all when one man assaults a woman.

Thank you so much for bringing this up! I also feel it is rather vile to try and turn this into a race issue as though only certain people are responsible for this sort of treatment of women or that it is only wrong because the perpetrators are not blond blue-eyed white people.

I am also a feminist and I also do not "hate men", but I do hate what favouring men above women (or any one group of people over another)gets us all.

I hope many people read this and echo your statements.

Whoa Ryan, hang on. Anger? As a professional editor & writer, I'd have to say that Fazeela's piece reflects a pretty balanced and even-keeled tone for a subject she is obviously quite passionate about.

But would there actually be something remiss about expressing anger over the rapes, murders, batteries, destroyed lives, anguished children, or four beautiful lives sunk like rubbish in a car at the bottom of a canal?

Should those of us who object to such atrocities always keep reason in our voices so as not to lose the sympathy of people such as yourself?

I don't have a strong opinion about whether we describe the deaths as "honour killings" or not. But I do know that violence against women is a worldwide phenomenon and will perhaps continue to be until enough people, including men (as those who tend to hold power to make change), get angry about it.

You state you find it highly offensive that some people dare to insinuate you love to hate men. Have your read your article? Have you just heard yourself?

You are not simply against violence you make very clear you are against violence against WOMEN. You are perpetuating a problem that is now beginning to turn counter-clockwise. It is no different than being against starvation only in Vietnam, though you may tokenly acknowledge starvation in Africa.

You state you have witnessed situations which seem extreme and no doubt not the norm where women have been encouraged to patiently wait through their beatings until 'he' asks for a divorce, or female victims of threats, rape or assult are patronized or arrested for being 'hysterical' after such attrocities.

These extreme circumstances, if completely true without any facts being left out, (ie: the hysterical assult victim is arrested because it turns out she threatened her partner with a knife and was hurt while defending himself.....) are sad but not the norm. Yet you fail to speak out about the sad but rare occurences of women who verbally, mentally, and physically abuse and kill. Yes my dear they do kill their partners and children but that's right we call that post partum depression or retalliation after years of abuse, but GOD forbid anyone make a reference to 'honour killing'.

Don't get me wrong, there is no such thing as 'honour killing' it's murder full stop but that's in our minds not the perpetrators' - and the crown will need that term if it intends to prove premeditation.

I've followed this story and never once saw an article or comment supporting 'honour killing' all comments are against even the use of the term. However like I said, it is a term used to support the motive nothing more, so no need for your high horse. You did notice one of the perps was female right? And, the mother right? I wonder if you believe she was a victim too. Did she murder her 3 children because a man told her to? Did she not seek help in a democratic country because her husband tied her up? Did she not possibly want rid of her husband's first wife?

Extremism is dangerous whether it's religious, political, or feminist.

We should be against violence against any fellow human being, period!! Anything else simply creates more prejudice and perpetuates the problem.

Fuzz I see your point. Actually all the points made in the above comments make sense. Be it honor killings or violence against woman, this is something we have been perpetuating for a long time. You can assign this to any culture or religion, anywhere in the world. The end factor is the destruction of free will.

Violence is not just act it becomes a Psyche; A girl raped will question her role in it, even though she did not consent. Its easy to win the argument if you take the stand of violence towards all is not fair or right; but when you look at the amount of violence committed towards one sex, its hard to debate. Woman have a large part in this well, we stay silent when we see another in abusive relationship. We do not want to interfere, its none of our business, we don't know the circumstance, we come from different backgrounds...etc...etc.

People are afraid to actually help, instead we like to argue or politicize the situation to (her)death.A man is one of the greatest being in a woman's life. My father is my idol, he gave me a sense of security and self assurance that no woman can ever give.Be a kind man, woman, and human.

Most males in Canada reject violence against women. I compare it to drunk driving or child abuse in that it is something that we as a soceity have agreed to be unacceptable acts by our citizens under any circumstances.

The problem that I have with the term "honor killing" is that it implies that for (many, some or few?) it is culturally acceptable to kill women under certain conditions.

To me, the name honor killing is offensive as it attempts to justify a horrible crime.

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
C. S. Lewis

Perhaps the difference is in the way convicted "honour killers" are not protected here.

This from Barsa Iraq~~~

There has been no improvement in conviction rates for these killings. So far this year, 81 women in the city have been murdered for allegedly bringing shame on their families. Only five people have been convicted.
During 2007 the Basra security committee recorded 47 'honour killings' and three convictions. One lawyer in the city described how police were actively protecting perpetrators and said that a woman in Basra could now be murdered by hired hitmen for as little as $100 (£65).

Seven months after the murders, the problem of these killings in Basra has become worse, according to lawyers. Ali Azize Raja'a, an Iraqi prosecutor who has represented the victims of 32 'honour killings' since 2004, said that, despite accumulating sufficient evidence to prove who was responsible in each murder, he had won only one case.

Fazeela, I think your article is very well written but to not make the public aware of these killings as an "honour killing" does a disservice to the millions of women who are abused because they have brought "shame" to their family.

Yes, honour killings are "are simply another manifestation of worldwide oppression of women through violence." However, as a person who works with abused families, I would argue that it is the variance in the manifestation that makes all of the difference.

A woman sold into the sex trade from the Phillipines is different from a German woman being beaten by her drunk husband is different from an Afghani woman being beaten or killed because she was raped, bringing "shame" to the family as a result. All are serious, all are unique, all deserve to been seen for what they are and not lumped into "violence against women".

When people in society kill their loved ones because their religion demands or excuses it, be they Muslim, Christian, what have you, then that fact needs to be brought to the forefront. To deny it or downplay it only further excuses the behaviour and perpetuates the cycle.

the writher has clarified the types of vilence being practiced in every society, developed and developing. she wants to show forms of vilence are different but the act is going on.agreed! question from the writher is that
1. whether there is no civilization in the history of mankind where this sin(violence against woment) is not being practiced?
2. How can we save the women from violence?

I loved this article and all the intelligent comments. I don’t feel the need to side with any particular view point, since it’s evident by all the comments here the genuine concern for those disadvantaged as opposed to promoting some other dubious agenda.

In the case of the Shafia family we still don’t know anything for sure and what role each of the accused played, if any. But if indeed the mother accused is convicted in being complicit in the four murders that would add women violence against women to the mix. It would be interesting to hear your view on that post-conviction.

Ryan,
Perhaps if you were a woman you would feel more passionately about this. Your comment is a typical perception: Men are passionate; Women are irrational.

Fazeela,
Thanks for speaking up!

I think this is a really complicated situation and it's too simplistic to call it this way or that way.

-There is too much violence against women, in general, and much of it is perpetrated by boyfriends or husbands. Nothing ethnic about this part.

-However, if you do some deeper digging, you will find out that, for instance in the Vancouver area, the Indo-Canadian community has a disproportionately high number (much higher than city average) of murders, particularly murders within families.

This is symptomatic of a cultural mindset which, unfortunately, encourages men to take up violent means in order to solve family problems. Not sure if it's 'honor' (i.e. ego or image driven) or simply a patriarchal way of thinking, but it is cultural in this instance.

- I don't mean to pick on one group but statistics do not lie.

- We need to integrate everyone to the same extent and one of the overarching societal values should be that men and women deserve the same treatment and deserve dignity. Not a case of 'some being more equal than others'.

Why is everyone missing the point? Violence against spouse/partner is present in every culture. But killing one's female children when they don't conform culturally is not the accepted norm in "western" society.

Kudos to you Fazeela.

reading all the articles posted so far show the pros and cons with respect to your passion on the issue and your stand re:"Violence against Women".

Being a frontline worker takes a lot of strength and perserverance to meet the abused, listen to them, document the acts of violence - to be used in courts etc and myriads of anxiety you have to put through in the course of your work.

You have risen and put your ame forward. What has happened in Montral is despicable and I can not fathom any religion that condones such acts in name of religion. This was sheer cowardice and brutality - leaving the victims no chance of escape. Poor souls. RIP.

I am sure there may be fanatics reading your article as well and for you to voice yourself. It takes extreme courage to speak openly. Keep up the good work and may God Bless You.

This is an islamic honor killing masking it as violence against women is a coverup.

Sometimes families in pakistan will kill the male who is wooing their daughter and kill the daughter as well if the families can't agree on their child's choice.

Generally women are the victims because it is a cultural practice in Islam of second class status. No need to list the myriad examples that occur even now in the mideast. I don't agree with your attempt to provide a cover up to this news by placing it under the umbrella of violence against women which is 100% correct however in this case not relevant.

You're of muslim descent and I think this is your attempt to deflect what it is. Call a spade a spade. Its first an Islamic culture-based honor-killing and you can place it in parallel with general violence against women if you want.

Stats can be skewed however you want to manipulate them. Doesn't change the fact what is acceptable in Islamic societies and cultures.

Great article, violence against women in any name is still violence against women. However the author misses the point that 'honour killings' happen, are happening in Canada and many of us are going WHAT?!!

There has been a problem in Canada with honour killings and community workers not sure what to do, not wanting to appear racist for condemning such crimes-or even 'let them sort out their problems'!

When people come to Canada they need to be given full disclosure that violence against women is not tolerated, that there are shelters for women and children and help available. Can more be done to reach immigrant women who may not speak english and are sometimes literally trapped?

Violence against women takes many forms and I have been a victim of psychological violence with the constant threat of physical violence. It took a long time to realize what was happening and I had always wondered what was wrong with women who stayed in abusive relationships.

I found out, it happens over time, the guy begs for forgiveness, he cuts you off from your friends, family and support and on and on. Men who commit abuse against women have a pretty standard playbook! I felt I could not ask for help because I was not being beaten. People had an idea what was going on but offered no help. Luckily I had the financial means to get out before things got worse, but for many this is not the case.

It is disingenuous to compare the tolerance of abuse against women which takes place in Western countries versus for example Muslim or Hindu countries. In the West there are structures in place to protect women (imperfect, but generally good), laws guaranteeing equality, etc.

In many Muslim and Hindu countries women are legally convicted for being rape victims, suffer genital mutilation, are denied proper medical care, cannot drive vehicles, cannot initiate divorce, etc.

Speaking of honour killings is not racializing the debate (this word "racializing" in this context irks me - so Greeks are of one "race" and Lebanese are of another "race"? I thought both were Caucasian!); it is telling it like it is.

Whether it is as a result of culture or religion, in certain countries abuse of women is tolerated and encouraged. Why don't Muslim communities in North America speak out against honour killings, genital mutilation, etc? I never read about any rallies or any repudiation of these reprehensible practices.

One can only deduce that these practices are not wholeheartedly repudiated by the communities. If they are, then will the groups please speak up, speak out, and let Canadians know that you share our values?

Circuitous arguments between 'lumpers' and 'splitters'. Know you for which you are. I am a lumper, violence is violence, murder is murder. There is no excuse or condoning either. In that fact, I trust we are all in agreement. Consequences should be appropriate. Therein lies another controversial issue.

Gender, race, religion, etc are all the fodder of the splitters for which there will always be a differing opinion to fuel debate mistaken by some for argument. But please let's hope we never lose sight of what we agree upon.

The article attacks a splitter point, opening the door for the comments posted. The debate is on, each opinion a rendition or opposite of the other, getting us nowhere but where we started.

The violence is done. How do we prevent it in the future? This is our dilemma. Planning an escape or offering a safe haven is only an interim, and unfortunately not an infallible, solution. Do you meet violence with violence; murder with murder? Do you punish or prevent?

Is education part of your prevention? What do you teach? The fodder of the splitters have to be understood and taught for what they can be but not necessarily are. Enablers.

It's very easy to point fingers at others. The challenge is to make others look at themselves and realize the true consequences of their actions on themselves, others and our community as a whole.

I agree with Regius Brown.

As a female who grew up sheltered from all minority cultures, but who also had a HUGE crash course upon post-secondary education in a program where I was a minority, I feel that so many Canadians just want to understand "why" (motive) someone would kill someone else.

People want to understand the "why" to ease fears of course but also to prevent it from happening again. I had never heard of "honour killings" prior to this news article, and I feel that I still do not truly understand how shame can be such a burden as to mentally rationalize murder. It's not racist to want some understanding of "why".

I'm getting a little sick of this misguided notion that certain groups are somehow entitled to more support over another group.

I don't deny that there are women who are brutalized by men, just as I don't deny that there are women that are brutalized by women. Why are you focusing on only the former in your tirade?

If you want anyone to take you serious, I suggest you put aside your sexist agenda and argue for mutual respect between everyone, regardless of gender, race or ethnicity. Anything else makes you come off as a man-hater.

I agree with you completely. Violence against women should not be given any other title as it relates to culture or country. I believe however, that the legalization of prostitution may be a better way forward than to criminalize what has been and will remain a cross-cultural phenomenon.

Women and men who are sex workers would have rights. Rights to stay safe and rights to avoid being exploited by pimps and other criminals.

Joyce, you ask, "Why don't Muslim communities in North America speak out against honour killings, genital mutilation, etc? I never read about any rallies or any repudiation of these reprehensible practices."

Let's take the example of genital mutation. Since it is practiced equally by some Christians and Muslims in sub-Saharan Africa, you should also be asking why churches are not organizing rallies against this practice, and why black Canadians are not loudly protesting. Christians and blacks in Canada are not doing so because they do not feel responsible for the actions of others who happen to share their religion or race. This is why Muslims may feel that your expectation is unfair or perhaps even biased.

Hmm!! Seems like a whole lot of jumping to conclusions all across the board here. Plus a lot of he said, she said.

A quick review of the facts:

First wife's family's opinion: Honour kilings.
Boyfriend's opinion: Not honour killlings.

Accused: No comment.

Police: No comment.

So it seems to me that people are talking about honour killings based solely on the origins of the accused. Which sounds like racial profiling to me.

What about the other motives? Hate to get all Abrahamic on you but motives do tend to gravitate around the seven deadlies: envy, anger, greed, pride, lust, gluttony, sloth etc., though the connection of the last two to this case is a little hazy.

In this media-driven age of instant gratification, its probably too much to ask people to wait for the trial to satisfy their morbid curiosity about what happened, thus all that jumping to conclusions, blaming cultures, Islam and of course, men.

Funny, I once knew a criminologist who said that there were few crimes perpetrated by men, rape included, that weren't planned and egged on by a woman. As a feminist, she felt that men just didn't have the smarts or the self-control to pull off a complex, criminal plot by themselves. According to her, the difference in crime statistics across genders arose from men who were doers who couldn't shoot straight and were too proud to admit that they hadn't hatched their plan themselves. So, the real crime boss got off scot free. Puts a whole new spin on all that loyalty women like to cultivate towards their imprisoned boyfriends.

I am curious to see how that plays out here. Daddy and Sonny boy acting all macho and pointing fingers at each other as criminal masterminds while Ma Shafia cries her eyes out and claims she was as terrified and beaten as Karla Homolka.

Feminists have never taken on true adult responsability for the dark side of women's nature. They prefer to infantilize women as victims instead. Fact is, women like violence, fast and easy money and total control over other people jsut as much as men do. And they are much more willing to do anything for a buck, as any glimpse at porn will demonstrate.

So Ma Shafia gets a free ride from the media and some help victimizing herself while Islam, Indo-Canadians, Abrahamic traditions, male ego, western complacency etc all get kicked in the oompa-loompas.

Moral of the story: sometimes intellectualization, rationalization, idealization are coping mechanisms to deal with the horrifying reality of the evil that lies within. In other words, feminists need to realize that just because men kick them around doesn't make them necessarily more virtuous. Men kick women around because women tend to be smaller and men tend toward impulse control issues. In return, women manipulate men for fun and profit.

However, it does guarantee that Ma Shafia will get a much lighter sentence, cushier amenities while incarcerated and an easier time getting parole.

To the multiple people who have posted in outrage about how the author is ignoring violence against men, or starvation in Africa, or the fact that Heroes was renewed for a 4th season... those things were not what her article was about.

Complaining that she didn't address the fact that we've had lousy weather this summer, and instead chose to focus on discussing a particular view of violence against women, doesn't negate her arguments or make them any less relevant.

Hi Fazeela,

First of all, great article. I can see how, with your job making you see the worst of treatments on women, you would have your own, strong point of view and I respect that. But everyone’s point of view is subjective, depending on our experiences, our cultural background, and our decisions when faced with challenges.

One thing, the 4 women were killed by a husband, his son, AND the wife? Violence against women, by women? This reminds me of all the problems they had in Toronto many years ago, when African mothers would take their small girls out of school, to have them incised. No male was involved, even the midwives doing the terrible surgery.

Going back to your article, I had never heard of the term honour killing until I just read your article a few minutes ago. In spite of all my traveling all over the world, I guess I remain a white, ex-Christian Canadian with little direct exposure to your and similar cultural terminology.

Violence Against Women, I have heard of. All Canadians have. But you know, growing up, I was witness to as much if not more violence against males than females. You may not see that in your job but I know from personal experience that most males, like myself, would not call a crisis line if they were mistreated.

For one, I was raped years ago. Nobody ever learned of my embarrassing truth. I have certainly never considered calling a crisis line. I was repeatedly beaten as a child, by my mother. I never told anyone until I finally started panicking at the thought that the anger growing inside me as a teenager would one day blind me into hurting my own abusive mother.

I would have been charged with violence against women had I not had the clarity to tell her older sister. And, probably, the crime would have classified me as a woman hater, without investigating the cause. I believe that quite often, barring Eastern cultures quite different traditions, a male who grows up hating women and hurting them has often been hurt severely by women, usually by his mother. Ever think of that? Probably not, since you see the other side of the story every day.

My brother-in-law was raped by his aunt when he was pre-adolescent. I was shocked when he confided in me, proudly. He sees it as initiation by an older woman and would never claim she wronged him.

You see, the point I am making is that although violence against women is a fact, is terrible, and is present in Canada, so is violence and rape against males. But most males have been taught never to divulge or report these crimes. This makes your statistics a bit lop sided, of course. Males also, even more than females, would never report being abused. We are taught, usually by our mothers, not to show weakness. We are also taught that outing our abuser would bring on much more pain than we presently experience.

So, in conclusion, I hope I have given you another perspective, one that may dilute your own, alter it slightly, but that will not deter your vocation. It might, however, leave a little room for compassion for all those males who walk around wounded. I don’t agree with violence, against anyone, but I do believe that it happens to both sexes, every day, but it is usually reported by women. When a woman tells her friends she was abused, they usually encourage her to report it. If a man should dare report such abuse to fellow males, he certainly won’t be encouraged to report the crime. Thank God women do, at least.

Miss or Mrs. Jiwa is right on the money with her analysis.I witnessed the same treatment afforded a friend when she went for help; at a government funded organization, she was turned away and had no choice but to return home.It was her last, she died that night from violent abuse. If men were abused in the same manner, you can be sure it wouldn't be tolerated.

It is with great relief that I read the comments of women who know exactly what the problems are when dealing with violence against women. I totally agree that the media is portraying a very limited and targeted group to be responsible for the horrific acts of violence against women. In actual fact it is nothing short of sensationalism and further justification to penalize a religious group that has been the accepted target for hatred and discrimination for years.