One thing that I think should have been mentioned on your program is that there are many new pre-owned and older renovated condos available on the market. They should also be considered when shopping for a condo. They are already good to go! You can see exactly what you are purchasing, the measurements are exact and there are no illusions. Don't Believe the Hype! Posted by: Erin Mandzuk | Jan 9, 08 11:03 PM

Great show...I purchased a brand new condo in 2006 from Tridel. It's been nothing short of a nightmare. The show is completely accurate. Caveat emptor is definitely the rule. The huge problem I have run into is with the developers' complete disregard of the many serious deficiencies in the building and in the units themselves. Several fellow unit owners have either the same complaint or worse. They truly do not care and their level of disrespect towards us, their "customers" is appalling. Its just as you say in the show, it's either go ahead and sell your unit at a huge loss and buy another condo at a higher up-market price or hire a lawyer which costs more money without any guarantee of success and an indefinite court ruling timeline. Contact the City of Toronto and ask for building inspectors to come over and have a look, merely wasting your time. I'm now totally convinced large developers have city officials in their back pocket. Write letters and emails of complaint, happy trails...an exercise in futility. Report the issue to Tarion...another waste of time. How Tridel ever won the "Developer of the Year" I honestly do not know, it's mind boggling in fact. And to add fuel to the fire the developer owns the property management company plus the utility company providing the electric service to the building and all the suites...all 900+ units owners pay a monthly "administration" charge to the utility company, called Provident, to the tune of $9.50...if you do the math on an annual basis, a really nice chunk of pure profit at the expense of the unit owners. And lastly, if you think you can seek the assistance of your condo corporation's board of directors, think again. The property management company and thus the developer by extension have very tight reigns on the BODs. Posted by: AJ Caines | Jan 9, 08 11:43 PM

Great one Wendy! The bottom line is buyer beware. The developer's contract is written by their lawyers to protect them. Take a REALTOR with you and take the offer to your trusted real estate lawyer. Developers in BC are not covered by the same legislation (the Real Estate Development Marketing Act) that protects buyers and sellers of re-sale real estate (the Real Estate Services Act). Be careful and be aware. Posted by: Matt Collinge - the 604homesguy | Jan 10, 08 01:49 AM

If I had seen your program last March, I might not have bought. Monarch is supposedly a reputable builder, but they treat their clients like 2nd class citizens, and I bought only on the strength of their reputation. Posted by: M-M Giroux | Jan 10, 08 02:31 AM

If you decide on a follow up please give me a call. I purchased a new condo from Context on what used to be the old CBC headquarters in Toronto. The shortcomings of the final suite are too numerous to be listed and the way I was treated after purchasing was despicable. The only buyer recourse available in Ontario is TARION (I was surprised you did not try to interview them) and they are a complete joke. Posted by: Tony De Simone | Jan 10, 08 09:08 AM

Please do a follow up program soon and focus on older condo buildings and the problems Owners face within them. I don't recall hearing the names of those individuals interviewed and they are not included in the credits on the webpage. For those condo Owners who are feel that no one is listening, please visit the Canadian Alliance for Condominium Owners Rights at www.cafcor.org Posted by: Markie | Jan 10, 08 10:39 AM

Erin: Good point about pre-owned condos, but make sure you go through strata notes and do your research. In Vancouver we have a problem with leaky condos. I've had friends who've had to pay repair bills as high as $80k on their unit. Many condos have now been repaired, but you still see tarps around town and some newer buildings are now showing problems (it's very wet here). There are some images at this site- http://vancouvercondo.info Posted by: Tim K. | Jan 10, 08 12:51 PM

I was disappointed with the one sidedness of this Marketplace episode and found it odd that only one home builder was singled out for attention while the others were obscured from view and were never mentioned by name. Certainly looks like someone at Marketplace had an axe to grind. Not the usual even-handed reporting I have come to expect from Marketplace. Posted by: D. Russell | Jan 10, 08 03:55 PM

Thanks for the eye opener. We are just now looking for a condo for our daughter in Toronto, trying to get her out of the slum landlord hell she has been in for the past several years. Now she has arrogant, indifferent, untruthful so called "high classed" developers to deal with. It makes me ashamed to share Canadian citizenship with people like that. What is happening to our wondrous land. Posted by: C. Philp | Jan 10, 08 03:58 PM

I'm glad Marketplace points out how the politicians are ignoring these serious issues. As for me ( I'm the guy with the clicker ) the developer of our condo happens to sit on the BC Real Estate Council, so our situation is complex. I'm still fighting and a decision will be made soon. These types of marketing ploys that developers use falls under the category of "Deceptive Dealing" but how's one going to afford a lawyer to fight the semantics of legal definition? In our case a lawyer quoted us $15,000 and no guarantee of winning. Yes we used our own agent, and yes we had a lawyer. Still knowledge is power so educate yourselves as best as you can. Lastly , a big 3 cheers to the couple on the program the declined a settlement in favor of speaking publicly regarding their matter. And a further hats off to Marketplace for airing this program. I'll definitely check out that website posted by Markie. We need to voice more and get these politicians involved. Best of luck to the owners out there. Posted by: Danny D'Angelo | Jan 10, 08 04:49 PM

Good programme, but it only scratched the surface. I think the most telling comment was the comparison between purchasers of condos and purchasers of any other high-ticket consumer good, and the relative protection available to them. We've just spent over $500,000 on a condo, and have no recourse against the developers despite them supplying incorrect information, hiding behind (almost) impenetrable layers of blaming other people and, in some cases, just plain-out lying. It is extraordinary that the government does not take a more active role, and I think that all the many disgruntled condo purchasers need to start lobbying their representatives hard. Posted by: Andrew Horberry | Jan 10, 08 09:27 PM

Your show was accurate and you did a great job in choosing Bob Aaron as your lawyer of choice. He is on top of all matters when it comes to condos and making sure that the builder isn't messing around with the clients. We have been fortunate to have Bob as our Lawyer and the hard work he has done in the real estate industry is phenomenal. As far as the rest of the show it was disappointing you should have used more builders instead of picking on just one. Posted by: Lloyd Speyer | Jan 10, 08 09:46 PM

Congratulations for the great show! I have been waiting to see it because I was considering buying a condo. Yes, I *was*. I heard about some sad stories with condos in the past but had no idea it could be that bad. The condo business, as it stands right now, is clearly all hype and all about buying and then hoping to sell the property after a few years for a handsome profit -- it is not a long-term investment. Also, some provinces, such as Quebec, do not have regulations regarding condo fees. Therefore, condo fees are usually kept to a minimum to make the cost of ownership more attractive. However, this generally results in too little funds being set aside for emergency repairs and scheduled maintenance. So, someone buying a "pre-owned" condo might end up paying big bucks for the major repairs a few years down the road. Posted by: Dyson Luong | Jan 10, 08 10:35 PM

we have put a deposit for the Tuscany Gates. it has been postponed five times. it was supposed to be ready in august 07, it was postponed to Oct 07,then again to Jan 08, then again to march 08 and we recently received a letter and this time postponed again for May 08. We are very patient and hope we get what we asked for. We are now paying for rent for an basement apartment with no laundry which was OK for a short period of time, plus pay storage for our furnitures. Posted by: Sham Beebee | Jan 11, 08 09:59 AM

The show about the condos was really good. I bought a condo from the same developer featured in the story. As a current condo owner I know that the problems can arise years after you move in. The building needs time to settle. I know that there may be problems in fact I expect problems. I know it will take time to fix them. But condos are still an affordable option to live in the city. The homes in Toronto are old and too expensive. My lawyer changed a few clauses in the contract and added a square footage in the amendment so at least I think I will be getting what I paid for. They should do a follow up with the builder of MODE that was cancelled. You should always be realistic about what you are buying but I think the story focused too little about the government and there was nothing about TARION. Posted by: I.P. | Jan 11, 08 10:28 AM

I enjoyed the report on the issues of purchasing a condo in Canada, especially in Toronto. Being a condo owner myself as well as the president of my condo board, I have dealt with many owners as they have moved into their units in my building and the many complaints they have had against the builder. Although your article was indeed informative, just by reading the comments stated on your website from other owners who also saw the article, there is more to be reported. I think that an in-depth series of articles looking into what owners can typically expect after signing on the dotted line from builders and organizations such as Tarion is needed. Frankly, just to have a lawyer and an former condo seller state how things are is not good enough. Albeit, a condo is not what the average person envisions as their first home, it is still just that, a home, and still the biggest investment in a person's life. It is not your duty as a show to become advocate to condo owners everywhere but at the same time, builders and politicians have to be held accountable for broken promises and pie-in-the-sky dreams sold. If you need perspective on what might typically happens after one moves into their new condo, please feel free to ask. Posted by: Alex T. | Jan 11, 08 12:27 PM

Marketplace did a good job of presenting the facts provided to them. They should do the same for new homes like single homes and townhomes also. I admit that I work in the building industry and would like to defend the builders a bit. It is clearly a 'buyer beware' situation. Purchasers need a lawyer to check their contract who is specialized in new home deals as Mr. Aaron points out the so called 'one sidedness' protecting the builder is the norm. Naturally, a builder is going to draw up their contract to protect themselves against the elements affecting them, weather, trades, material shortages giving them options to deal with the issues they may face. Perhaps builders need to advise when it comes to variances in sq ft or floor plan layout changes. Tarion protects a Purchaser against any sort of real misrepresentation. Or perhaps builders require a more accountable architect. As far as not getting what you thought, many purchasers are not familiar enough with the questions they should ask until it is too late and they move in to their condo only to face disappointments about finishes, sizes etc. Remember a sales office 'model' should be a sample of the floorplan and I believe that there is a disclaimer about the products used to finish the model. Usually best finishes are used. Maybe builders are taking on too many buildings to deliver as promised thus delivering some substandards in the rush just to say it's done. A Purchaser is spending a lot of hard earned money.They deserve an over the top delivery. After all purchasers are driving the success of the builders. This negative impression and feedback is unfortunate for the rest of the industry who work hard and are proud of what they deliver. Let's be thankful that we have enough builders in the Toronto area particularly to deliver the condos' to the public. Builders are for the most part doing their best. Purchasers need to do their homework. Anyway, let's all celebrate the new condo lifestyle. Posted by: J.D. Browning | Jan 11, 08 01:16 PM

This CBC Marketplace piece is a must see for any buyer considering a condo. I did a blog post: http://activerain.com/blogsview/334546/What-you-should-know; here are some excerpts: Bob Aaron says it like it is, "builders have sway, consumers don't" which just about says it all. Builders, developers (or sociopaths) or whatever you want to call them, "write the rules for themselves", and with a disregard for the rights of buyers. Bob started the CBC segment stating, "Consumer protection is horrible", and ex-agent, Charles Haynes, says he hasn't seen any "Condo Police". Who is supposed to be regulating to protect the Canadian home buying public, like the auto industry is regulated? Why is this "huge marketing machine" allowed to "bait and switch"? New home buyers are being "hung out to dry" right across Canada; here are examples: BC: http://www.cashsociety.net/TheFacts.aspx NS: http://www.canadiansforproperlybuilthomes.com/html/whatsnew/nov2007/novascotia_constructionproblems.pdf Our elected officials at every level are so dependent on the political donations and favours of the building (and insurance) industry that we have little hope without a giant public outcry, and sometimes that doesn't even help. In my opinion there is no political will to do anything that would cut off the hand that feeds them. The fact is that politicians in power don't care and they are not accountable. The leadership void in government is disgusting. John in Port Moody, BC www.johngrasty.ca Posted by: John Grasty | Jan 12, 08 02:16 AM

I share D Russel's comments. Not the appropriate developer or sales agent to attack as they are one of the more honest and honorable developers and sales staff in the industry. Curiously why does one sales agent have their face blotted while everyone else's is exposed by the hidden camera? Posted by: cowie | Jan 12, 08 08:41 PM

Unfortunately, I was not surprised by the content of your program. As director of the intervention & mediation unit of CAFCOR - Canadian Alliance For Condominium Owners' Rights, I have the opportunity to speak with aggrieved condominium unit Owners on a daily basis. Your investigation revealed only the tip of the condo dilemma. There are also many Owners of units in older Corporations who suffer from very similar and unethical practices. Our organization was formed by unit Owners who faced much the same apathy from the Ontario Government as did those unit Owners interviewed in your piece. We invite all unit Owners facing problems with developers, Boards of Directors or property management contractors to contact us at (416)747-8889 or by e-mail at complaints@cafcor.org. There is no charge to unit Owners or their Corporations for our assistance. You can also visit our website at ontario.cafcor.org . CAFCOR is a "not-for-profit" volunteer grassroots organization. Posted by: Yvon Piché | Jan 12, 08 08:43 PM

Hello ! 1.Thanks for the 'condo' information documentary.This is another message to those people who are fighting "a losing battle" to get compensation for the leaky condo affairs.To compare thecar marketing to the condo marketing is excellent example and tells the leaky condo owners that they are losing as the politicians are not willing to do anything! The society does not benefit from this mad condo boom as it is dollar driven and soon will show up further problems. It may be leaky condos again or many other possibilities! In one of your earlier shows some engineers already hinted at this. It is only beneficial for the condo buyers and resellers who are riding the wave of inflation. Condo flippers. Our friendly billionaire Donald Trump is organizing sale courses to benefit fronm the USA housing collapse. I think he doesn't really care how people benefit from the courses but in reality he is just whipping up hysteria to keep this buy-sell frenzy going! Posted by: L.Novotny | Jan 12, 08 10:08 PM

Thanks - it was a good show. If you do a follow-up, can I suggest looking at the occupancy rent AKA phantom mortgage? It's ridiculous how much a developer can charge per month (e.g. $1,800/month for a 850 sq ft unfinished-but-ok-for-living condo). How do the developers even determine the rent? Posted by: D. Lee | Jan 13, 08 06:22 AM

I can appreciate the woes, concerns and disappointments expressed in your episode on purchasing a new condominium. Last spring I came close to purchasing a small penthouse suite (mid-$200K) in a 37-storey condo in Toronto from one of the big-name builders (occupancy stated then was mid-2008). Unlike too many new condo purchasers, I immediately took the Agreement of Purchase and Sale to the lawyer, who recommended changes to several important items contained in it. The developer's solicitors did not agree to most of the changes. Equally disappointing was the disgraceful way in which they communicated their response: hand-written scribbles on a reply fax that was sent to the condo sales office and not to my lawyer as requested. However, the clarifications, explanations, comments, concerns and, most importantly, the recommendation, from the lawyer to not buy the new condo, were all easily worth the modest legal fee. I returned the Agreement to the condo sales office within the recision period and I received my $2000 deposit cheque back - and for me, getting that deposit back was easily the best part of the entire purchasing a new condo experience. I am also pleased to report that I have since purchased a beautiful resale condo in a wonderful, peaceful location outside of the City of Toronto that has a healthy physical and financial status. For those who are considering purchasing a new condo and don't care what is in those agreements, I say: go for it! For those who do care: at least take it to a good lawyer, for heaven’s sake. For those who want to buy and live in a condo with happiness, peace of mind and sleep at night, I say: consider looking at (carefully, of course) resale condos. Posted by: P.S.B. | Jan 13, 08 01:18 PM

The biggest problem is the poor construction standards that this industry is allowed to build in. The noise from your neighbors especially at Liberty Village and specifically Monarch buildings is unacceptable . When you can hear your neighbors through the thin walls peeing or having orgasms you know you paid too much. Look at the # of resales at Liberty Village from people who moved in and talk to them and you will find they are moving to find a quiet building. Posted by: Ivor Grimba | Jan 13, 08 02:16 PM

I can't see why anyone would ever buy a pre-sale condo. You don't even know what you are getting into. This is the biggest investment for most people. Never buy pre-sale condos. Posted by: james | Jan 13, 08 04:43 PM

This me feel a bit better for purchasing a house in the suburbs and contributing to urban sprawl Posted by: Giovani Soprano | Jan 15, 08 11:30 AM

Great episode. Bottom line is greed, and with greed someone has to suffer. Unfortunately it's the buyers. I live in Winnipeg, and the condo craze is minimal here. Over the past few years there have been some big time condos being built. But Winnipeg is a unique place. The people here are different. Maybe smarter? But condos don't sell well. For the price of a condo, one can purchase a very nice home. Say all the negative things you want about Winnipeg as a city, but the affordability and quality of life can't be beat. Posted by: Ronald D | Jan 15, 08 12:52 PM

While I agree with every element of your checklist and that it's definitely buyer beware, I thought your expose was more than a bit skewed. Surely of the 50000 condos that have been purchased and are being lived in in Toronto and Vancouver you could have found a few people who were happy with their transaction. Also, as others have pointed out here, the salesperson you dealt with was more above board and professional than 99% of the people at other developments - including new detached home sales. Why did you choose to only mention that one developer and no others? This is especially troubling since this developer hadn't reneged on any of its commitments (since the suite hadn't been built yet!). You unfairly painted them negatively and it's the most unbalanced reporting I've even seen in a Marketplace show - and I LOVE the show!! Posted by: Paul P. | Jan 17, 08 09:57 PM

I had a friend who bought a condo downtown Toronto. After getting married(and long before moving in), they decided they wanted a larger unit. The price had of the units had gone up, along with the unbuilt unit. When my friend inquired, they were only willing to credit the initial value of the unit (not the appreciated value) but he would have had to pay the current market price for the larger unit. Let's not talk about having to take possession before the building is finished, and having to pay "Rent" before the deed is transfered or finalized! The condo market is the biggest scam going and it's going to get bigger unless our elected officials step up to the plate. We need an Elliot Spitzer in Ontario (at the least) to go after them. Posted by: Ed B | Jan 21, 08 01:18 PM

This comment is mostly in response to J.D. Browning (above). I appreciate all your suggestions on what could be improved and hope they soon become a reality. You seem like someone in the building industry who cares however, there are 2 comments you make that I, as a new condo owner, find hard to agree with. First you say 'Let's be thankful that we have enough builders in the Toronto area particularly to deliver the condos' to the public'. I just moved into my new Condo Dec. 8th, one that I purchased in August 2004 (yes, we had no less than 11 occupancy delays). If there are enough builders, than why are buildings taking so long to be constructed, a problem that seems to get increasingly worse each year? And why do I overhear trades people in the elevator (yes, the one they shouldn't be using for work purposes) speaking about working on multiple developments at a time? Secondly, you state that 'Builders are for the most part doing their best.' I have heard so many stories and have my own to share about shoddy workmanship - not just aesthetics, but windows & doors not being properly sealed so that ice and condensation pools form inside the unit (not to mention how the loss of heat in this cold will undoubtedly push common expenses up even further)- that it seems like most are doing a substandard job. The most frustrating part about this is that the people who actually complete the work need not have any pride in what they are doing because they remain nameless/faceless to the owner and are not held accountable for doing a poor job. Overall I have not experienced quite the devastation of some (ie. project being canceled 2 weeks in or den actually being the size of a closet), and we are doing our best to enjoy our first "home". It's just a bit disheartening to realize how much quality is suffering in the builders' quest to sell-sell-sell. Posted by: Kate M. | Jan 21, 08 01:25 PM

Great program. Also glad to learn from the letters here that there is an organization called CAFCOR in Ontario (Canadian Alliance for Condominium Owners' Rights). Could CAFCOR help mobilize consumers and force our government to draft new protective legislations? It is quite clear that having a good lawyer does not solve the problem of the builder not delivering on the specification of the floor plan. During a time of rising prices, the builder can simply offer money back and leave the purchaser out in the cold. A toothless Tarion is also not much help when problems arise. Too many people are saying "no recourse". Enough is enough! Consumers need to unite to effect change. Posted by: Irene F. | Jan 22, 08 11:14 PM

I live in a condominium complex in Calgary. Our present Board shows discrimination in enforcing the Bylaws. For example, some dog owners are allowed to walk about with their dogs off leash, even though the Bylaws state that all dogs must be on a leash. New rules state that owners cannot park in the Visitor Parking in the courtyard, yet one owner consistently parks in a "No Parking" area in the courtyard, night and day. What is the most effective way to make sure that the Board enforces the Bylaws to all owners? We report these infractions, but are met with contempt and sarcasm. Posted by: Lois Ottewell | Feb 1, 08 07:02 PM

This is being allowed to happen in Canada? What happened to honesty and integrity? I wrote to the PM and most MPs, not a single response! So much for the Government, at all levels, taking care of the average consumer! As for lawyers - are they not supposed to be honest and ethical? The contract is so one sided, why does the seller even spend time and money on it - might as well just say: you pay us what we say and take whatever we give you! This is Canada? Posted by: BK Kang | Feb 1, 08 07:08 PM

This show is right on the money. I purchased a pre-built condo from plans. Researched the builder - not a single complaint with Tarion, let me repeat that, not a single complaint. Now I know why - complaints were only registered if the problem weren't resolved within a year, that's right, one full year, of Tarion receiving the complaint. It was months before the builder finally came back to hear and see what my complaints were about. Still want to buy a pre-built condo? My lawyer reviewed the contract and suggested changes - the builder refused. Multiple delays before my suite was finally ready. Still want to buy a pre-built condo? Several deficiencies in the suite - complained to the builder and got very negative responses from their lawyer. Officially complained to Tarion - no true enforcement and would take up to a year to correct - totally unacceptable. Still want to buy a pre-built condo? Needless to say, as soon as the building was registered (7 months after moving in), I sold it and moved. And, this is why Tarion never registered my complaint - I moved out of the building well before the anniversary date of my first complaint (there were multiple issues). I will never recommend to anyone to purchase a pre-built condo. And, did I reap the financial rewards of the appreciation of my condo unit? Nope, the Real Estate agent got all of it when I purchased the condo I now live in! Still want to buy a pre-built condo? Posted by: S Shaw | Feb 16, 08 08:56 PM

This is amazing documentary about builders.it would be better if you have another documentary about Property management company. Posted by: Babu Nagalingam | Apr 4, 08 10:40 PM

Do you think people really want to shop intelligently for a condo? As long as, "Do we get that chandelier?" is more important than, "Do you have a list of other projects in this area built by the same developer?", I have my doubts. Good job Market Place and continue trying to educate the home buying public. Posted by: Lynne Taylor | Jul 5, 08 06:18 PM

I absolutely love this show. Every episode I've seen has been an eye opener and this one is no exception. I am in thinking of buying soon and this info is great! Posted by: David | Jul 26, 08 04:33 PM

"This is amazing documentary about builders.it would be better if you have another documentary about Property management company." I totally agree. My condo complex has been having problems with various property management companies that we have hired and fired over the 8 years that I have been living in my condo. Making money for themselves and their shareholders comes first, while serving our complex comes a distant second or third. Long before I saw this documentary, I got kicked out of various sales offices because I walked in with my tape measure and asked too many of the right questions as I was doing rough room layouts. I can only think of how it got much worse now. Posted by: Claudio | Jul 27, 08 11:16 PM

Dear CBC, I bought a condo a few years ago and have had nothing but problems from leaking pipes to uneven flooring. I have searched high and low for a list of the worst/best condo builders in Ontario. I have contacted several associations including the Ontario Home Builders Association, and no one will help me. It is surprising how there is a push for the consumer to take a more active role when purchasing a home, however much of the required information is not made public. I am selling my current condo and I want to investigate the builder prior to a future purchase. Posted by: Jennifer Duteau | Aug 28, 08 02:00 PM

Thank you for bringing to the spotlight a serious problem. If you do a follow-up, one of the issues you may also want to address is the process by which condos are sold. I tried several times to purchase a condo but found that as soon as the sales office opened, the best and most affordable units were always sold out, leaving the average consumer with the worst suites. Investors, who have little intention of living in these units get first dibs and buy up a large portion of the units, which they flip at a higher cost (again to the average consumer) later on. Posted by: ponderthat | Sep 15, 08 04:31 PM